new to auctions

[Lyn Liechty]

Paul,

What's your problem?  You made a statement and I called you on it.  You asked for opinions and I gave you several.  I would love to see you prove me wrong!

I won't comment on your experience as a realtor since I really know nothing about you, although I see you felt free to allude to my "lack of knowledge" of realtors.

I don't claim to have all the answers, but should I come up with any, and should I have the audacity to post them on this forum, just do us both a favor and let your eyes glaze over and then move on to the next person.

Strike a nerve?  Perhaps a bit, but it is really  more of a case of an old codger who doesn't push easily and isn't to worried about speaking his mind.

This may surprise you and perhaps you will choose not to believe it, but I probably have a better understanding of traditional real estate listings and selling via that method than I do real estate auctions.  I am still in junior high, so to speak, in that regard.

By the way,  just curious, but why does one take potshots when getting answers they didn't expect and don't like and then finish off their postings with "Have a Blessed Day?"

Is that supposed to make everyone feel better?

Lyn Liechty, Auctioneer
www.lynliechty.com

[mcnuggett1848]

Paul,

What do you feel are the benefits of a traditional listing over an auction sale?

Thanks,

John

[sellsMdhomes]

Lyn,
 I believe if you read my first post,I was asking for opinions to give me a better understanding of how our 2 fields can be a convenient/profitable marriage for both of us.
 I really wasnt slamming anyones career..for some reason you started some bluster and seemed offended, which I explained in my second post if I did say something to offend, I was sorry and it wasnt my intention.
 Just trying to get a discussion going,not a stern lecture...speaking at someone instead of speaking with them is  not a great way to express yourself, especially on a discussion board.
 Im sure you are very talented and could teach me much about the business.....thats what Im looking for here.
 If you would like a productive,civil discussion about the virtues of our respective fields then I welcome dialogue...
 If its just not there for you, then I would expect you to respectfully decline to further comment to me.
 As far as wishing you a blessed day...last time I looked it is  a wonderful thing to wish for someone and as you said you dont know me and what I am about.Even if I feel put off by someone or we dont get along that well I am not above still wishing the best for everyone,personally I think its an admirable trait.
 May every day be more blessed for you then the one before.
 Paul

[Lyn Liechty]

Paul,

The problem as I see it is that you don't handle bluntness and honesty very well.

I spoke what I felt was the truth and I spoke it bluntly because your comments quite frankly were so wrong and so out of touch I had trouble believing what I was reading.

I take solace in the fact that others apparently were in total agreement with my words.

Perhaps with you, I made an incorrect assumption.  I have talked with many realtors over the years and while they profess to wanting to learn more about auctions, what they really want to do is establish a relationship with auctioneers, but not one where both auctioneer and realtor are of equal standing.

They prefer the auctioneer work in a subservient role and it is nearly impossible to explain the auction process to those types of individuals because they have a certain mindset when it comes to selling real estate and their minds and attidudes remain closed insofar as auctions are concerned.  There are many like this, but very few who realize that they are like this.  They will claim to want to learn more about auctions, but in truth all they are interested in is validating their own sense of superiority and self worth.

It was unfair of me to make that assumption about you at this time, so I will respectfully retract that particular judgement until I get to know you better.

I am trusting this will at least help to clear the air.

Lyn Liechty, Auctioneer

[auctionwally]

Hi Pebbles,

 I've written an article on this very subject. Here's a link to it: ]auctionwally.blogspot.com/2007/08/how-to-liquidate-estate.html]

Good Luck
AW

[Matt Price]

"An auction can sometimes be narrow in exposure and not truly give a house the opportunity to get top dollar."

Just what in the 7734 are we talking about here?

Narrow in exposure?  Lets talk about how MLS only attracts buyers who are interested in the particular number of Bedrooms or Bathrooms it has.

An Auction Ad attracts people who want to buy it that day, rather than it sitting there for six months.  It attracts investors and flippers who are interested in the house, versus the family who don't have time to find in a day to fix those problems.

"...give a house the opportunity to get top dollar."  Define that further.  If an item is sitting on a Wal-Mart shelf and it is priced at $14, but at one of my auctions it sells for $85 - just exactly what is the top dollar?  The $14?

It may be true that the listed price in some cases is higher than the auction price, however, how many times does a house have to be reducted to meet the auction price?

[Matt Price]

July 23, 2007, Overland Park, KS - During the "State of the Industry" forum at the 58th International Auctioneers Association Conference and Show in San Diego, the National Auctioneers Association (NAA) unveiled industry projections for 2007. The industry survey was conducted by MORPACE International and projected the industry to grow $7.6 billion in 2007. If the current trend continues, analysts project industry revenues to reach $264.8 billion by the end of the year. This is the fourth consecutive year that the live auction industry has witnessed growth. In 2006, the total value of goods and services sold at auction totaled $257.2 billion, an increase of 7.1% from 2005.

The MORPACE survey tracked growth within individual auction specialty areas. The largest auction specialty segment with estimated gross sales of $87.3 billion in 2006 was automobile auctions. The fastest growing auction specialty is real estate. Residential real estate auctions grew 39% between 2003 and 2006. During this same time period, land and agricultural real estate grew 33% and commercial and industrial real estate grew 27%.

The MORPACE quarterly survey compiles data from NAA members and non-NAA members. Forty-one percent of respondents reported an increase in gross sales receipts through the first half of 2007, with twenty-nine percent reporting "no change", and thirty percent reporting a decline. Thirty-four percent of NAA members say they have conducted more auctions in the first half of this year compared to last year. The survey also highlighted growth in the real estate sector with thirty-six percent of respondents reporting increases in residential real estate sale receipts and a twenty-three percent increase in commercial real estate. Charity auctions were also reported on the rise. Since 2003, total growth of this auction segment has increased 16.3%.

[emilyhetrick]

I just had to respond, I think the poor Realtor is a little underepresented here. I am a realtor in Oregon and I NEVER hear about anyone auctioning off their property. I've never even had a seller ask me about auctions. The only time it happens is when a property is in foreclosure and the banks will auction.

You said that auctioneers use all the same advertising plus more than a realtor? I beg to differ. Realtors ARE marketers, that's ALL we do. In some places the newspaper is obsolete and because we are cutting edge marketers we are using different techniques to get more of a response. I've never seen an auction advertised on craigslist and that's where 90% of my open house attendees are coming from. In your response, you make it look like we don't use email or flyers, either.

If it was a significantly better way to sell every property, and with people doing more research themselves online, we would hear about them more often. My take on this is that auctioning is good for certain situations (like banks who have multiple properties, although they still hire realtors a lot), but NOT gramma's estate.

Do you really WANT a "flipper" to buy her home rather than a family who will live in it and love it? Do you just want to hurry and sell it, regardless of who buys it or for how much? And by the way, most realtors are good people, trying to help and are sensitive to divorces, estates etc and can help carry the load through hard times... Nothing wrong with that!

[H.D. Wilkinson]

Hello Emily,

If you will go to www.auctioneers.org and do a "Find an Auction" search for real estate in Oregon, it will show you member's auctions in your state.

While you're there, you may want to explore the information available.


H.D.

[Richard Romanus AuctionServices.com]

Hi Emily,

I think the poor Realtor is a little underepresented here.

On this board there are several hundred Realtors registered. It seems that many are just lurking rather than engaging conversation.

I set this board up to open dialog between Auctioneers, Realtors, Home builders and general public as well. We are currently closing in on 1000 members in just a few months of going live. That should tell you that we have the ability to power market...

I've never seen an auction advertised on craigslist

I beg to differ!
Here is a page of marketing packages that do include Craigslist.

http://asmarketingcenter.com/marketing-bigdog.php

Review some of the other power marketing packages as well... We have many auctioneers as well Realtors that use our services regularly with great success...

Do you really WANT a "flipper" to buy her home rather than a family who will live in it and love it?

Do you really feel that the seller is concerned weather a nice all American family buys their home or a flipper? I think not! The sellers main concern is that it gets sold, quickly and as close to the money they need or want. I feel that the view sellers want just peachy people buying their home is for selling puppies not homes.

The Millennials Are Coming!
The new generation of "millennials." They are in their late teens to early twenties and could be ill prepared for a demanding world. This is the new generation of buyers. They are a throw away minded, self centered selfish, greedy and have very little respect for anything the baby boomer's valued. Selling them anything will take a much different mind set. Are auctioneers and or realtor's prepared? Throw sentimental thinking out the window if you plan to do business with this new group!

If you did not see this report on 60 minutes this week it is worth clicking the link below...
http://www.cbsnews.com/sections/i_video/main500251.shtml?id=3486473n

I am not an auctioneer however I have been on both sides of this fence. For 15 years we have host the largest number of auctioneers websites, custom designed and market their auctions/company. We can produce bidders/buyers, build them brand and image.

I work with many real estate companies and to gage the willingness of marketing in each industry the auctioneers have the marketing down to almost a science. They are not as interested in putting their picture everywhere and slamming a sign in the ground as they are in building trust, credibility and getting the job done in a very timely fashion.

And by the way, most realtors are good people, trying to help and are sensitive to divorces, estates etc and can help carry the load through hard times... Nothing wrong with that!

I am sure that this is the case! Auctioneers are good people as well and are very sensitive to any sensitive issue that the seller is facing. If fact I can say personally that this industry is more like one big family then any other industry I have ever seen.

Please don't get me wrong I did not invite you to this board to slam your industry. I am just trying to put to sleep some of your misconceptions about the auction industry which seems to be the case with many realtor's.

I am sure that some auctioneers have their off base opinions of your industry but this is what I hoped to accomplish with this site. Communication is power so open the doors and talk it out like professionals with out a lot of personal attacks. Who nows what positive results may come from it...

Just my two cents!


Rick R

[AAREAuctioneer]

I've never seen an auction advertised on craigslist

Posting real estate auctions on Craigslist is actually against the rules, but they allow you to post a picture of your genitals... go figure.

Our problem is jealous realtors turn us in for posting auctions in the real estate for sale category.

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/forums/?B=163308;forumID=6

The job of an auctioneer is to help people by delivering cash for assets in a specific period of time.

We are willing to work with realtors and have offered a Buyers Agent coop commission for every property we have offered at auction since my company was founded in 2001 with very few takers.

Until realtors acknowledged the market was going down in the past few months most were very antagonistic about the auction process UNTIL THEY TOOK THE TIME TO LEARN THE TRUTH ABOUT AUCTIONS...

Once you learn the truth about real estate auctions you will become a true 'borned again' real estate auction evangelist welcomed into the fold by the auction brotherhood.

realtors sell property using methods devised over the past 75 to 100 years.

or you can join us

Using 2000 years of auctioneer traditions combined with 21st century technology.

The choice is yours

[emilyhetrick]

It really seems like there is room for both kinds of selling. For the record, I would never turn anybody in for posting on CL! The only posts that I flag are the Realtors who don't mention in the ad that they ARE Realtors. I mistake them for FSBO's during my prospecting if they don't put in that info.

And I just wanted to respond to the comment that people don't care who they sell their house to. I work with a lot of people who have owned their homes 30 years or more or are selling the home they grew up in. Here in Portland we still get multiple offers on certain properties and the seller will always pick a family over a flipper if the difference in the offers isn't substantial. And generally the flippers/investors make LOWER offers than people looking for a primary residence. So yes, they do care. It seems like if they didn't everyone would be auctioning off their homes.

Also, what I meant by being "underepresented" was in regards to this post. I just noticed one realtor trying to respond to 3 or 4 auctioneers, so I wanted to give my two cents. I wasn't referring to the site in general.

I'm all for auctioning in certain situations and joined this site to learn more about it. Can you be a realtor and an auctioneer? Or are there regulations against that? It seems like then you could have the best of both worlds! Either that or we all need to affiliate with each other, recognize what is in the clients best interests for selling and go with it!

Oh yeah, about that next generation of buyers, they will certainly take a different approach than what people have been doing. Often, they know about cutting edge techniques before the realtors do. I am 30 and have been selling RE since I was 20 mostly to first time buyers. I don't think they are all self centered and greedy, that's a generalization that you just can't make about people. But they are very savvy and have the upper hand when it comes to technology. I just started a blog, I've been texting rather than calling and I'm constantly researching websites. Things I never thought I'd be doing 10 years ago when I got my license!!

[AAREAuctioneer]

Dear Emily:

I would like to take this opportunity to welcome you to the wonderful world of real estate auctions and encourage your education in the field. Traditionally there has been animosity towards auctioneers from the realtors but with the convergence of the 'perfect storm' in the real estate market we are fast approaching a time where working together is habit.

You are fortunate to be in a market where there is still price appriciation and mutilple "offers" are presented for unique properties. The statements you have made about "flippers vs families" (while I personally agree) is illegal according to HUD regulations as it is a discrimenatory practice.

A professional real estate auctioneer does everything the traditional real estate agents does after the sale, before the sale. Compiling a complete due diligence package, surveys, appraisals, disclosures, contract packages meaning everything a buyer would need to make a purchasing decision AND obtain financing... then all thats left is an open negotiation of the price at public

AUCTION = RESPECT

Consumers get angry when they discover that in many states it is actually illegal for an agent to tell a prospective buyer what the last "offer" (not bid) for a property was, even in these now rare multiple offer guessing game scenarios you are describing. (California for example I am not yet licensed in Oregon but will be in 2008) Don't get mad but picture this scenario:

You are working with a family to find them the perfect home as a BUYERS AGENT and helped them through the pre-approval process. End users or consumers are always willing to pay more for a product than a wholesaler or a dealer, if you don't believe me lets go to the auto auction for a few hours and play pick the type of buyer.

As a trained real estate professional (who is now ahead of the pack because of your auction education) you have a much better understanding of property values because face it the average person is involved in 2.7 real estate transactions in thier lifetime. You have nutured or coached the family through the loan approval process and through the hours invested in your customers know pretty much what they are looking for in thier new home combined with the financial reality involved.

As a 21st century real estate professional you don't feel a need to trap buyers in your car and try to "sell them" one of your listings, rather you have developed a list of properties which loosely meet their profile for them to review at home (or work) on-line to whittle down the list of potential properties to purchase.

Since these are your buyers and you sent them the listings as a professional registering your buyers with the auctioneer using a simple one page form was done early on to protect your commission and your buyers from a less scrupulous agent who just wants a sale, not a relationship.

On a side note: My mother became a realtor in 1973 in Southern California and I can tell you about cold dinners and ruined family events all because that dreaded phone rang and some pesky customer took her away from us.. but heck she was making over $100,000.00 a year in the 1970's so money was always the excuse. To this auctioneer family & quality of life are the reason I work and the money is no fun if there is not someone I love to spend it on... drifting away from the message of.

Every aspect of the auction process is designed to respect your time, schedule, family, buyers, sellers, cooperative agents and more.

The initial screening of the property is done on-line (many listings I have taken have been done on-line too but thats the other side) at your leisure.

Property previews (not open houses) are limited usually to 2 to 3 dates at specific times to allow different schedule types. For instance we like to have one on a weekend about a week to ten days prior to the auction, one on a weeknight or evening I call it the after work preview then a final preview on auction day if the auction is held at the property or another advertised time if it is an offiste auction.

AUCTION = RESPECT

The sellers time is respected now because they have two to three scheduled times for the preview and they are to be G-O-N-E from 1/2 before to 1/2 hour after. If they cannot clean the property the auctioneer schedules a cleaning company, staging team or whatever the best method on the budget allows for property preparation. During the "bubble" respect of privacy was the number 2 reason for listing with us as auctioneers over a realtor... not leaving any money on the table is number one but thats for another lesson.

The family you are working with has a professional agent sourcing potential properties to be screened on-line then previewed at one of two firm dates. Professional auctioneers do not give private showings unless the property is very high end, remote, commercial or has a darn good reason but rest assured dinner is never dropped or a soccer game missed because of an ad call you just got.

After the previews you can determine what the property is really worth to your customers and how much they can afford to spend on any property. The DIGIBIP (Digital Bidder Information Package) has all of the technical information that agents typically tell people they need and expert to interpret for them.

AUCTION = RESPECT

My mother had a bad habit of insulting peoples intelligence because they might not understand or be familiar with some obscure term buried within the 54 pages of the standard residential purchase contract used in Southern California or the 40 to 150 pages of addendums, not including the 8 to 15 pages of escrow instructions.

To say that multiple "offer" home purchase contract scenarios open to a plethora of contingencies, subject to and weasel clauses from hell are the same as an auction, insults my intelligence.

Asking me as a buyer to make an "offer" based on a number you (the agent) are forbidden by law from telling is an insult to my intelligence.

Providing all of the information required to make a logical usually a life altering decision is demonstrating respect for your buyers and sellers alike.

AUCTION = RESPECT

Everything is disclosed in advance leaving only one thing remaining for negotiation, the price.

Who will open the bidding at one hundred thousand dollars for this fine home... thank you very much we have one hundred asking one fifty, do we see one fifty, now two hundred thousand asking two fifty, two fifty in the rear we are now asking three hundred thousand will you bid three hundred? now three fifty, is there three hundred fifty thousand in the room thank you we are now looking for four hundred thousand dollars... do we have four hundred anywhere... Ok lets take three seventy five who will... of thank you now we are asking for fourhundred do we have four hundred thousand dollars? yes we have four hundred thousand dollars. are there any increases over four hundred thousand dollars?

Its really that simple and if you were representing the buyer at our auction you would have earned 3% when the property closes in about 30 to 45-days with no contingency other than the seller delivering good title.

[Richard Romanus AuctionServices.com]

Emily,

Thank you for the response and points well taken. It is obvious we all have a lot to learn...

And I just want to respond to the comment that people don't care who they sell their house to.

I am really glad to hear this since it makes me feel better to know that some people still do really care... I am also glad that there are people like you ready to accommodate these sellers...

Also, what I meant by being "underepresented" was in regards to this post. I just noticed one Realtor trying to respond to 3 or 4 auctioneers, so I wanted to give my two cents. I wasn't referring to the site in general.

I understand fully...

Oh yeah, about that next generation of buyers, they will certainly take a different approach than what people have been doing. Often, they know about cutting edge techniques before the Realtors do.

You are correct they are very tech savvy and as an employer of many bright tech minds I fully understand about this. We try to hire the best of the best fresh young minds from VA Tech. Our company is built around technology and that is what I have done for the auction industry for 15 years. In many cases we dragged auctioneers kicking and screaming. However today that is not the case at all they want to know every time I do a seminar what is new and cutting edge.

My point was not that the new generation are bad kids. Many I have interviewed had very disturbing work ethic, lack of good face to face communication skills. I know I may sound a lot like my father did during the 60's 

However I have yet to see the ability to come down to a more human level with out email, IM,  cell phone, PDA and or laptop etc. I have not lost hope just need to prepare for this new work force in order to keep my company on the edge.

At 56 years old I find myself being more like a counselor and dad then their employer. They are great minds and again I speak just about the ones I have had direct  contact with.

My question is how will they be as buyers and sellers? Will they move more for a tech method rather than any personal contact? Will they continue the as in the past of working with a Realtor or auctioneer?


In your quest for good websites take a look at a few of ours:
AuctionServices.com * NationalAuctionList.com * ASMarketingCenter.com * PushPullandDig.com * LandandShingle.com * UBuyUDrive.com * BackoftheCloset.com * EquipmentLiquidations.com * SeizedandLiquidations.com * SilotoSoil.com


Richard Romanus
President & CEO
AuctionServices.com, Inc.
Blue Ridge Digital Multimedia Production

[Matt Price]

Not to add flames into the fire...

But I do believe that a "Pissing contest" is the trade of ideas.  If you have counter points, then post them.  Making up facts and running on either side is not a discussion.

Every time I see a discussion where there are counterpoints and a person is backed into a corner because they can't back it up they bow out calling the other person rude.  It's not rude when you are exchanging facts.

I have emailed and been on forums with both Lyn and H.D and they are both well versed.

---- Snip ---

Now, when we are talking about auctions versus real estate, here is what I tell my clients.

As an auctioneer, I start at a reasonable price and I may go down until I get a bid then bid up until such time as I have exhausted bidders.  In real estate, a number is placed on a listing and if it don't sell, then they take money off the table until it is sold.  So as Auctioneering goes up, listing it in a retail real estate manner goes down.

Those TV shows where they offer $50,000 more for the property than it is worth is a nice dream, but not a rule.

Since we have been speaking about the next generation of buyer:

http://www.cbsnews.com/sections/i_video/main500251.shtml
http://www.cbsnews.com/sections/i_video/main500251.shtml?id=3486473n